Italy trip - 2018

[GraemeW]

Well its time to start planning another trip. 

As mentioned somewhere before, those of us on the Portugal trip this year thought it would be good to go to Italy next year.  I will start putting together a draft programme in due course.  This is to start the discussion to see who's interested, route suggestions, etc.  We probably have 3 or 4 of the hard core tourers already for this trip  We will have a planning session before or just after Christmas, probably in west London somewhere.

Some initial thinking.....

When:  September or October 2018
How long: 2 week trip

Possible routes could include: Northern France, Black forest germany, Bavaria, through Austria into Italian dolomites,  Italian alpine passes, lakes,Tuscany, med coast into france, french alps, home.  Not sure we will have time to go further south in Italy.  We could make journey there just travel time on motorways, and have more time in Italy, or make the journey there part of the tour, taking in the sights and best roads. or a hybrid of those two options.

Possible visits to Porsche in Zuffenhausen (I know someone who works there), Ferrari in Modena, and maybe some other Italian supercars?

Given the distance, looking at options to get cars transported part of the way there or back to save time.

Budget: approx £3k - £4k.  I know thats expensive if you add to a family holiday as well, but these trips are well worth it.  Do at least one in your Nomad or Atom.  you could do part of the trip also.

Once we have a group going, we will probably move the  day to day discussion onto a WhatsApp group, with just updates here on the forum.

[c_a]

One advice from a german: Black forest could be to cold and wet in late september and october to enjoy it.

[Steve Gibson]

I'd say September rather than October. The weather is likely to be better. Maybe even late August into early Sept.

Speaking personally, I'd rather keep discussions firmly on here until much closer to any trip. Finding and reading information on a phone, using WhatsApp, is a royal pain in the Atom seat, compared to using the forum as a resource.

[GraemeW]

Agree, I was trying to avoid the holiday hordes in August, but they will be coming the other way so we could set out late August. 

Thanks c_a for tip on new forest Black Forest.  It was just one particular road I wanted to try.

[Steve Gibson]

[quote="Digger"]
Agree, I was trying to avoid the holiday hordes in August, but they will be coming the other way so we could set out late August. 
[/quote]

Crossing northern France and any of the Alps is pretty easy in August but I expect northern Italy will be busy.

[MrLizard]

sounds interesting - was planning an Italy / northern lake trip through Switzerland etc next year so could be well up for this.

[Curves Junkie]

This is to start the discussion to see who's interested, route suggestions, etc.

I'm from south Germany, not far from Zuffenhausen and if you want some support for the trip planning maybe I can help.

We probably have 3 or 4 of the hard core tourers already for this trip

How much kilometers are you thinking to drive by day in the mountains?

Possible routes could include: Northern France, Black forest germany, Bavaria, through Austria into Italian dolomites,  Italian alpine passes, lakes,Tuscany, med coast into france, french alps, home.  Not sure we will have time to go further south in Italy.

WOW, that sounds very interesting. 
Keep in mind that this tour will be > 4000 km without south Italy.

I'd say September rather than October. The weather is likely to be better. Maybe even late August into early Sept.

Early June a lot of passes at the central alps (Swiss, Austria) are closed (winter lock). It depends how much snow fall during the winter - how long.
Mid July to End of August a lot of bikes and crazy cyclists are on the road. Most 3-4 of this idiots are driving side by side uphill and downhill they have a speed 90 km/h and more.

The best time to have a lot of fun with the ariel at the mountains are Mid of June and the first two weeks in September. After that time the risk you have snowfall is to high and the swiss and austria passes they close temporary at September.
And keep in mind in the morning before 9am the temperature is low and after 4pm the daylight is weak.

It was just one particular road I wanted to try.

Which road? Show me at google maps.

was planning an Italy / northern lake trip through Switzerland etc next year

@Digger's thoughts about the possible tour - it's possible to include Switzerland after
Italian alpine passes, lakes and before the french alps.

Perhaps excluding Tuscany, med coast into france.

[Rob Evans]

I could only make the last fortnight in July.
Aug and Sep are out.
October is unknown, but daylight in short supply.

Rob.

[GraemeW]

Rob thats a shame.  I can't do until September.  Perhaps there could be two trips? 

[GraemeW]

Hi Curves Junkie.

The trip planning is still very early stages, so nothing in detail yet.  For southern Germany, main reasons I wanted to go that way (other than its sort of on a straight line from Calais to Austria), is that my brother lives in Hemmingen (he wants to see the Atom) and I would really like to visit the Porsche factory.  Ive been through Zuffenhausen so may times before but never been to Porsche. 

The road I was thinking of was the route 500 hochstrasse from Baden Baden to Freudenstadt.  Ive heard its a good route, but perhaps you could confirm or advise?  It would be great to meet up with you if we pass through?  Perhaps join us for some/all of the trip.

I don't think we will have the time to cover all the areas I mentioned in my first post, but it was just ideas at this stage. All feedback, advice and recommendations, especially from a local is very welcome.

My preference is  first two weeks September or as soon as holidays over in August

[Curves Junkie]

The trip planning is still very early stages, so nothing in detail yet.  For southern Germany, main reasons I wanted to go that way (other than its sort of on a straight line from Calais to Austria), is that my brother lives in Hemmingen (he wants to see the Atom) and I would really like to visit the Porsche factory.  Ive been through Zuffenhausen so may times before but never been to Porsche.

The straight and toll-free way from Calais to the alps is this way:
https://www.google.de/maps/dir/Calais/50.6355511,3.4018718/49.6256245,6.0791089/Porsche+Museum/47.4223256,10.7837378/47.3787305,10.5689948/47.3228243,10.5401169/47.2865499,10.6475742/47.2553605,10.7384471/46.8856155,11.0387954/@48.6033556,7.0619919,7.29z/data=!4m22!4m21!1m5!1m1!1s0x47dc3f75d7f1e363:0xacbed9e08cd279f4!2m2!1d1.858686!2d50.95129!1m0!1m0!1m5!1m1!1s0x4799da8732ced9e1:0x3c80648eb55f7987!2m2!1d9.1522879!2d48.8343414!1m0!1m0!1m0!1m0!1m0!1m0!3e0

The road I was thinking of was the route 500 hochstrasse from Baden Baden to Freudenstadt.  Ive heard its a good route, but perhaps you could confirm or advise?

The Black forrest area is around Pforzheim, Baden-Baden, Offenburg, Freiburg im Breisgau, Villingen-Schwenningen, Herrenberg.
Here the B500 It's a nice road to drive but lot of sections are speed limited to 70km/h.
https://www.google.de/maps/dir/48.7785571,8.1853431/48.4881346,8.2732337/Freudenstadt/@48.5468074,8.404383,10z/data=!4m15!4m14!1m5!3m4!1m2!1d8.2543668!2d48.7353242!3s0x47972202b03cb4db:0xebea1a142e05ac8!1m0!1m5!1m1!1s0x47973400a1fc3059:0x41f6bb7a5df5700!2m2!1d8.4179988!2d48.4644796!3e0

My suggestion is to drive directly from Calais to Zuffenhausen, sleeping, next day go to Porsche museum https://www.porsche.com/museum/en/ and Mercedes Museum
https://www.mercedes-benz.com/en/mercedes-benz/classic/museum//
2. day a day trip at the black forrest incl. B500
3. day Route driving like my first link above, going on Timmelsjoch, Jaufenpass, now you are at the north of dolomites.

Perhaps join us for some/all of the trip.

Are you sure you want this? 

I don't think we will have the time to cover all the areas I mentioned in my first post, but it was just ideas at this stage. All feedback, advice and recommendations, especially from a local is very welcome.

It depends which guys you are. 
Hard core tourer and drive Junkies like me or driver who like drinking tea every thirth parking place and visiting every sightseeing places.

My preference is  first two weeks September or as soon as holidays over in August

Last year I was at Ariel factory and I had learnt that it is decisive to get a very good price for the tunnel train or the ferry if you book it very early.
e.g. booking today from 27.08.-10.09. --> 83 + 81 GBP thats quite cheap. The ferry is 20 GBP more expensive.

[rjygill]

Gents,

I am interested.  I was planning driving the Atom from Scotland to Lake Como this summer.  Some of the routes mentioned look very interesting as do the factory visits and its always more fun to travel in a small group of like-mined enthusiasts/idiots ..lol.

I have a small place in Bellano on Lake Como that can sleep four (two double beds) with off road parking and a garage that can accommodate one if not two Atoms (need to measure).  Monza is not far and neither is the MotoGuzzi factory which I hear is very good although I am not a fan.

Most importantly the Passo Dello Stelvio pass is about 140km from the location.

Regards,

Rob.

[GraemeW]

Rob.  Great.  Yes it is good to be in a group.  A days driving in great cars on great roads, then the evening socialising with your fellow enthusiasts/idiots in some new location. Will begin looking at this trip this month, with a view to publishing a first draft routes in January, and perhaps fixing dates and accommodation then as well.

I will PM people who have offered advice etc to incorporate that

[Osky]

Well its time to start planning another trip. 

As mentioned somewhere before, those of us on the Portugal trip this year thought it would be good to go to Italy next year.  I will start putting together a draft programme in due course.  This is to start the discussion to see who's interested, route suggestions, etc.  We probably have 3 or 4 of the hard core tourers already for this trip  We will have a planning session before or just after Christmas, probably in west London somewhere.

Some initial thinking.....

When:  September or October 2018
How long: 2 week trip

Possible routes could include: Northern France, Black forest germany, Bavaria, through Austria into Italian dolomites,  Italian alpine passes, lakes,Tuscany, med coast into france, french alps, home.  Not sure we will have time to go further south in Italy.  We could make journey there just travel time on motorways, and have more time in Italy, or make the journey there part of the tour, taking in the sights and best roads. or a hybrid of those two options.

Possible visits to Porsche in Zuffenhausen (I know someone who works there), Ferrari in Modena, and maybe some other Italian supercars?

Given the distance, looking at options to get cars transported part of the way there or back to save time.

Budget: approx £3k - £4k.  I know thats expensive if you add to a family holiday as well, but these trips are well worth it.  Do at least one in your Nomad or Atom.  you could do part of the trip also.

Once we have a group going, we will probably move the  day to day discussion onto a WhatsApp group, with just updates here on the forum.

If you are planning to arrive to the Tuscany, you have to do the Raticosa - Futa from Bologna to Florence (and of course I will be with you on the road! )!!

Please note that around Bologna - Modena (about 40 km of distance), there are:
Ferrari (Maranello)
Lamborghini (Sant'Agata Bolognese)
Pagani (near Modena)
Ducati (Bologna)
not so far there is Dallara (near Parma)

About 2 days to spend if you want see all museums and factory.

If you have an idea about the place, I can suggest you some "best Italian roads", some famous and other less.

Ciao
Osky

[GraemeW]

Grazie molto Osky

Yes it will be good to meet up with you. Will begin planning the trip in January, and will PM you for advice on roads etc.

Ciao