Question about oil consumption

[MonsieurX]

Let's not twists things... They didn't offer any free repairs. They think they are not at fault, they tested the engine after the build so given these guys reputation in the lotus world and i know 3 of them who are satisfied - never a problem.

Of course now, no expert was there to see what happened and the guy who build the engine either. Everyone thinks the fault was not theirs.

I'll have my mechanic check it thoroughly when i get it back. I just want to prevent this issue again. I thought i could rely on the oil pressure sensor, but not really in the end - like most gauges  ...

At least now i know it's not the oil dripping all over... Back to the bad dipstick idea i guess...

I do have to say that the car felt like it had a bit more punch than before... Let's hope it lasts as long as before

I may sound like a hypochondriac but when it comes to cars, i am... Experience i guess

[Monza]

i didn't write anything about "free" repair/rebuilt ...

[AtomMadStew]

Would a Separate stand alone oil pressure gauge put your mind at rest?

[MonsieurX]

How would a separate oil gauge help? the pressure goes up and down when you drive so in the end you can't tell unless you stick your eyes on the gauge...
A gauge that gives you your Max pressure with a delta from last Max might help - and it would need a running avg just to keep you informed of the levels as you go lap per lap... Kind of too much...

Am i right?

[speedmachine]

[quote="MonsieurX"]
How would a separate oil gauge help? the pressure goes up and down when you drive so in the end you can't tell unless you stick your eyes on the gauge...
A gauge that gives you your Max pressure with a delta from last Max might help - and it would need a running avg just to keep you informed of the levels as you go lap per lap... Kind of too much...

Am i right?
[/quote]

not quite. The oil pressure goes up and down, but when you hit the throttle it goes up and when you release it, it goes down, on the track for instance, under full load, it will allways go up all the way, if it doesn't do that you can release the LOL pedal.

But you are right that you have to stick your eye on it and that's why there are digitial gauges with warning lights you can adjust to your taste. In my race car I had a digidash  with that specific function. You can set the minimum oil pressure at preset revs, so you never have to watch the gauge untill you see a light. There is the possibility though that it will blink when you shift like a pussy, because than the pressure goes down faster than the revs and it'll think it's low, but you'll recognise that pretty fast.

on the other hand, I just like the part where I don't have one in the Ariel...but in your case it might be better for the time being.

[MonsieurX]

Thanks. I'll see if i can do that with the DL1/dash3... I already put in a graph of the pressure+pressure. There's a max pressure also but im not sure how often it's reset/useful lap after lap...

Maybe a separate gauge is what i need...

[AtomMadStew]

It might just put your mind at rest on the parabolic turns.

[toms]

I don't want to harp on - but do you really think it's necessary?  There are hundreds and hundreds of Atoms out there that go round corners fast every day.  Indeed, yours did for 6 years, now all of a sudden it won't? 

Quite a coincidence......

[MonsieurX]

Tom, mine has done circuit since 2009 - i never got the history of the car from the previous owner when i asked... So i cannot tell what the previous owner did with the car. Im probably at fault for the oil issue last year but as you know, i had a big share of issue previous to that.

I hope that Komo will accept their fault in this issue. But now im in safety/panic mode. When i requested the engine rebuilt options i asked for safety and reliability and clearly it's not what i got - but the guy insists that it should be that way. Let's see how this works out in the future.

From a mail i re-read, there was only 2.4 L of oil left in the engine after this last issue. So not all of it was gone. I just hope this was a fault in the build. And im going to be extra careful with the oil now.

Thanks all for your comments and help.

[toms]

No problem Xavier

But the fact remains that 2 litres of oil cannot vanish into thin air......

Fingers crossed for a good result for you 

[speedmachine]

Xavier, are you telling that you had it rebuild in the first place because oil all ready disappeard before the build? It seems that they just didn't fixed the problem...or am i thinking to easy?

[MonsieurX]

No, the first problem was bad oil, not enough oil changes in a relatively hot (26+C) racing season. I had full oil levels in the morning and after a couple laps the engine started making a noise - but there was already a problem as the top speeds on top of Les Combes in Spa was 10Km/h under the usual. Something might have been already broken - by the time i noticed it was probably too late and i didn't hear it in time.

The second problem came after running in the engine. Oil level also was ok and in 20 minutes of track session the oil level dropped very fast. I didn't notice until the engine noise alerted me of a problem - again too late but not as disastrous as before when a piston rod went through the block.
 

[MonsieurX]

The mistery "thikens..."

I got my Atom back and had a long talk with the head of Komotech Daniel.

First of all, i didn't know but their garage is BIG! About 40 lotii spread in the parking, a garage as big as the old Ariel factory plus 2 other buildings which i didn't look into. They were also working on an old Escort MKII, Cat's etc. The garage is full full full, but clean. Customers coming in and out. I didn't see any but they even have F1 drivers as clients!

So we talked a lot about oil... They only use Motul 15w50 for my engine. Seems a general consensus also with Monza. But then the question about the oil level came and the oil stick/gage.

We compared the standard oil stick from the K20A's and they are about 5CMs longer. The holes are a big higher - which according to Daniel these are higher than the original so it's probably a customization from Ariel so there's less chances of being too low in oil when the car turns since it turns a bit harder. Sounds reasonable. He also said that he filled the engine with exactly 5.2 liters of oil and the stick showed that the oil was on the lower half of the 2 holes on the stick. So we added another .5 L to top the 2nd hole.

This according to Daniel is where the problems can come (plus the fact that the baffled sump i had was not really useful to stop the oil from staying on one side on long turns). Problem with too much oil arise such as when the crank dips in the oil and then making bubbles of the oil when turning when running and then reducing the oil flow in the pump. He showed me how the engine runs part by part in the engine and how this caused the last problem - the oil goes from piston down and the con rod bearings, being the last to be lubricated, loose their lubrication and break.

He's seen 4 engines (or 4 atoms) with this same problem. Maybe a problem to watch for?

I know i filled the oil above the top hole last year, earlier this year, im not sure anymore...

Im going to monitor and change the oil level and pressure carefully from now on. Doesn't seem as complicated as my taxi ride's 964's oil measurements and filling issues - they have it complicated!

[speedmachine]

The motul quality is good, no problem there, probably better than the magnatec (pretty sure actually)

everything you're writing is common known and nothing new, overfilling, bubbles, bad lubrication and it is known that our dipstick is different to allow some more oil in due to the slight angle which the engine is mounted in and so on... but where does the part start where he explains how his 5,7 liters of oil vaporised in thin air...

And are you telling me my baffled sump is no good? Or is yours not stock option?

Following this thread with great interest, but it does sound a bit odd and now you mentioned the name of the company, I believe in the Lotus scene, where they mount the K20a in the Elise/exige it's name isn't all that good all together...there seem to be 2 camps on this one.

[MonsieurX]

The baffled sump i had came with my AA2 2006 - in Komo's opinion, it wasn't good. I dont know about yours but I've seen an AA3's owner getting a better baffled sump (or the baffles) post car purchase so you might want to check that.

I checked a lot for Komo issues with clients but couldn't find any except for the delays. So although they are very very very slow (apparently because of a busy season and a missing mech - this time, someone's mother didn't die and the kid didn't break their arm )...

I know a guy with an elise and a Komo build engine and the thing never breaks. So i cannot say what happened to my engine after they rebuild it... Komo cannot understand it either. Apparently 2 liters of oil were gone (not 5.x)...