and we both talked about how it had turned so many people off to diesels in their regular daily drivers. Also don't forget, GM also used it in some trucks back then as well. Assuming it ran it was rolling junk. 
Electric Vehicles
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Driver
Re: Electric Vehicles
I remember that Oldsmobile. Funny that this topic would come up the same day that I had just talked about it with my father. Spent three hours with him down at the hospital yesterday morning and we were discussing the car industry in general. My Father worked for Toyota in the 70's and Honda from the 80's until about 5 years ago. Diesel trucks, Dodge's all new V6 diesel for the 1/2 ton specifically was the topic. That Olds was one NASTY piece of work and we both talked about how it had turned so many people off to diesels in their regular daily drivers. Also don't forget, GM also used it in some trucks back then as well. Assuming it ran it was rolling junk.
and we both talked about how it had turned so many people off to diesels in their regular daily drivers. Also don't forget, GM also used it in some trucks back then as well. Assuming it ran it was rolling junk. -
benyeats
Re: Electric Vehicles
[quote="Curator"]
Yes,yes,yes...we are running out of oil. So,in the meantime let's all conserve,and the diesel does this TODAY,with zero cost to engineer.Zero.It already exists. I don't know why Americans are so reluctant to use a diesel. They are very torquey,quiet and run forever on a gallon of fuel. Meanwhile,we can progress toward 100% clean,solar,wind,tidal produced electric cars. Probably not in my lifetime is what I am guessing...
Diesels are available NOW! The problem is,too many politicians are looking too far ahead, and have no plan for TODAY,only a hope for tomorrow.
[/quote]
When renewing the Mrs' car we chose a petrol over the equivalent diesel. In the UK diesel costs more than petrol and some of the latest petrol engines (Audi TFSI in this case) offer economy that is close enough to diesel levels that it is not worth the compromise of a diesel.
Diesels have come a long way in recent years, but still only rev to 5k ish and sound like a tractor, not from inside the car as they have tons of soundproofing but even a very modern unit still rattles like a MF (Massey Ferguson)
Yes,yes,yes...we are running out of oil. So,in the meantime let's all conserve,and the diesel does this TODAY,with zero cost to engineer.Zero.It already exists. I don't know why Americans are so reluctant to use a diesel. They are very torquey,quiet and run forever on a gallon of fuel. Meanwhile,we can progress toward 100% clean,solar,wind,tidal produced electric cars. Probably not in my lifetime is what I am guessing...
Diesels are available NOW! The problem is,too many politicians are looking too far ahead, and have no plan for TODAY,only a hope for tomorrow.
[/quote]
When renewing the Mrs' car we chose a petrol over the equivalent diesel. In the UK diesel costs more than petrol and some of the latest petrol engines (Audi TFSI in this case) offer economy that is close enough to diesel levels that it is not worth the compromise of a diesel.
Diesels have come a long way in recent years, but still only rev to 5k ish and sound like a tractor, not from inside the car as they have tons of soundproofing but even a very modern unit still rattles like a MF (Massey Ferguson)
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Heywood-Yablowme
Re: Electric Vehicles
You chose the gas over the diesel because it was cheaper.
Diesels rule!
Diesels rule!
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benyeats
Re: Electric Vehicles
[quote="Curator"]
You chose the gas over the diesel because it was cheaper.
Diesels rule!
[/quote]
Actually it wasn't and will cost slightly more to run but will be a much better car to drive. We had diesels in the past and they were alright but would never say they rule
You chose the gas over the diesel because it was cheaper.
Diesels rule!
[/quote]
Actually it wasn't and will cost slightly more to run but will be a much better car to drive. We had diesels in the past and they were alright but would never say they rule
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Heywood-Yablowme
Re: Electric Vehicles
Lies! 
Diesels are the answer to the worlds current need for an alternative fuel.
The problem is, everyone sees diesel fuel as nothing more than a different grade of gasoline.,which is not the case.
Diesel is much easier to refine,using much less energy to produce,is very safe to store and transport,does no degrade like gas,has twice the BTU energy as the same volume of gasoline...
....and smells just like it did 50 years ago. Mmmm...love it!
I may have to convert one of my Atoms to run on the stuff!
Diesels are the answer to the worlds current need for an alternative fuel.
The problem is, everyone sees diesel fuel as nothing more than a different grade of gasoline.,which is not the case.
Diesel is much easier to refine,using much less energy to produce,is very safe to store and transport,does no degrade like gas,has twice the BTU energy as the same volume of gasoline...
....and smells just like it did 50 years ago. Mmmm...love it!
I may have to convert one of my Atoms to run on the stuff!
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benyeats
Re: Electric Vehicles
[quote="Curator"]
Lies! :D
Diesels are the answer to the worlds current need for an alternative fuel.
The problem is, everyone sees diesel fuel as nothing more than a different grade of gasoline.,which is not the case.
Diesel is much easier to refine,using much less energy to produce,is very safe to store and transport,does no degrade like gas,has twice the BTU energy as the same volume of gasoline...
....and smells just like it did 50 years ago. Mmmm...love it!
I may have to convert one of my Atoms to run on the stuff!
[/quote]
Diesel is not the answer it is made from the same resource we are running out of. It is find for tractors or busses but not for a car you might drive for pleasure
Ben
Lies! :D
Diesels are the answer to the worlds current need for an alternative fuel.
The problem is, everyone sees diesel fuel as nothing more than a different grade of gasoline.,which is not the case.
Diesel is much easier to refine,using much less energy to produce,is very safe to store and transport,does no degrade like gas,has twice the BTU energy as the same volume of gasoline...
....and smells just like it did 50 years ago. Mmmm...love it!
I may have to convert one of my Atoms to run on the stuff!
[/quote]
Diesel is not the answer it is made from the same resource we are running out of. It is find for tractors or busses but not for a car you might drive for pleasure
Ben
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Heywood-Yablowme
Re: Electric Vehicles
Wrong again,Ben...diesel IS the answer for TODAY.
Tossing the internal combustion engine out the window is the knee jerk mentality of a society that is currenty getting a hybrid enema.....!!
Tossing the internal combustion engine out the window is the knee jerk mentality of a society that is currenty getting a hybrid enema.....!!
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benyeats
Re: Electric Vehicles
[quote="Curator"]
Wrong again,Ben...diesel IS the answer for TODAY.
Tossing the internal combustion engine out the window is the knee jerk mentality of a society that is currenty getting a hybrid enema.....!!
[/quote]
One of us is wrong I don't think it is me. Explain why it is a better solution than petrol and how it does not face exactly the same problems ?
Ben
Wrong again,Ben...diesel IS the answer for TODAY.
Tossing the internal combustion engine out the window is the knee jerk mentality of a society that is currenty getting a hybrid enema.....!!
[/quote]
One of us is wrong I don't think it is me. Explain why it is a better solution than petrol and how it does not face exactly the same problems ?
Ben
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Heywood-Yablowme
Re: Electric Vehicles
Ben,Ben,Ben....ever hear of biodiesel? While petroleum may dry up some day,biodiesel derives its energy from...wait for it...the Sun! It is a renewable resource and will always be available,assuming the Sun shines!
Now,please let's not get into the emissions end of this discussion again
Diesel technology exists TODAY and can use a fuel that is renewable,TODAY. Not maybe tomorrow..or the next day .. THIS is what we should be persuing instead of magic batteries and electric plug-in cars.
Unfortunately,society loves to dream....
Now,please let's not get into the emissions end of this discussion again
Diesel technology exists TODAY and can use a fuel that is renewable,TODAY. Not maybe tomorrow..or the next day .. THIS is what we should be persuing instead of magic batteries and electric plug-in cars.
Unfortunately,society loves to dream....
Last edited by Heywood-Yablowme on Wed Aug 12, 2009 12:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Driver
Re: Electric Vehicles
I don't consider bioDiesel a option. All it does is cause farmers to plant crap weeds and corn instead of people food and essentially drives the cost of other feed grains through the roof. Thus the trickle down effect is that for saving a little oil you wind up making the public pay though the nose to feed their family. Bio fuels just will never be viable for the masses for this reason. Just not enough land to grow enough and still put food on peoples table.
To me if the vehicle is large it should be diesel where fuel economy is better. With lightweight cars, gas or diesel are both viable from a mpg perspective. I'd still like to see a 4 or 5 cyl inline diesel in a Toyota pickup but they don't send those to the States. Chevy and Dodges are bigger than I need, don't want a V6 with twice as many moving parts.
To me if the vehicle is large it should be diesel where fuel economy is better. With lightweight cars, gas or diesel are both viable from a mpg perspective. I'd still like to see a 4 or 5 cyl inline diesel in a Toyota pickup but they don't send those to the States. Chevy and Dodges are bigger than I need, don't want a V6 with twice as many moving parts.
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Heywood-Yablowme
Re: Electric Vehicles
Corn? Driver,you had better check up on your info.
The last track event I attended,I just barely beat a biodiesel car for FTD. That sucker was FAST!
He produces ALL of his cars fuel at home.YES! From his small 1 acre hunk of land.I believe he uses soy bean oil.Grows them,preses them, races with the fuel.
Ask Audi and Peugeot about diesels.
Do not speak from ignorance on biodiesel,please!
Besides,there is PLENTY of diesel available TODAY!
Electric cars have only been but a pipedream since it was ever considered for cars many years ago.
Still is just a pipe dream....
I really don't want my tax dollars spent on a technology that is MUCH more costly than other viable alternatives just because is seems like the politically correct thing to do.
The last track event I attended,I just barely beat a biodiesel car for FTD. That sucker was FAST!
He produces ALL of his cars fuel at home.YES! From his small 1 acre hunk of land.I believe he uses soy bean oil.Grows them,preses them, races with the fuel.
Ask Audi and Peugeot about diesels.
Do not speak from ignorance on biodiesel,please!
Besides,there is PLENTY of diesel available TODAY!
Electric cars have only been but a pipedream since it was ever considered for cars many years ago.
Still is just a pipe dream....
I really don't want my tax dollars spent on a technology that is MUCH more costly than other viable alternatives just because is seems like the politically correct thing to do.
Last edited by Heywood-Yablowme on Wed Aug 12, 2009 1:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Driver
Re: Electric Vehicles
I was speaking of BioFuel in general that means diesel and gasoline alternatives.
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Heywood-Yablowme
Re: Electric Vehicles
I was speaking about BIODIESEL.
Ethanol is NOT an answer,I agree. It runs like crap in todays engines unless the vehicle is a flex fuel or is properly tuned for Ethanol.The stuuf has 40% less energy than gasoline,gallon for gallon. It's better than nothng...but sucks as an alternative fuel,in my eyes.
BIODIESEL,on the other hand, is easily made from many plants,and is the answer to powering vehicles.
Ethanol is NOT an answer,I agree. It runs like crap in todays engines unless the vehicle is a flex fuel or is properly tuned for Ethanol.The stuuf has 40% less energy than gasoline,gallon for gallon. It's better than nothng...but sucks as an alternative fuel,in my eyes.
BIODIESEL,on the other hand, is easily made from many plants,and is the answer to powering vehicles.
Last edited by Heywood-Yablowme on Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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tarsman013
Re: Electric Vehicles
many people dont realize when the original diesel engine was invented, it ran on vegetable oil, not a fossil fuel
thank wars for bringing in the fossil fuel and removing the vegetable oil.
thank wars for bringing in the fossil fuel and removing the vegetable oil.
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WorkingOnIt
Re: Electric Vehicles
Even Mercedes is feeling the pressure to post some better non-diesel mileage figures.
S400 hybrid here now
http://www.popularmechanics.com/blogs/a ... 18293.html
S500 hybrid concept
http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2009/09/10 ... brid_merc/
S-Class entirely hybrid in 2014?
http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/env ... benz_N.htm
" 'The modular configuration is so versatile that we're seriously exploring the possibility of equipping the next generation S-Class models entirely with hybrid drivelines,' said spokesman Dan Barile. The next generation of the S-Class is due in 2014.
The exact form it could take — such as variations of today's gas-electric hybrid, diesel-electric hybrids, plug-in hybrids — has not been determined."
S400 hybrid here now
http://www.popularmechanics.com/blogs/a ... 18293.html
S500 hybrid concept
http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2009/09/10 ... brid_merc/
S-Class entirely hybrid in 2014?
http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/env ... benz_N.htm
" 'The modular configuration is so versatile that we're seriously exploring the possibility of equipping the next generation S-Class models entirely with hybrid drivelines,' said spokesman Dan Barile. The next generation of the S-Class is due in 2014.
The exact form it could take — such as variations of today's gas-electric hybrid, diesel-electric hybrids, plug-in hybrids — has not been determined."
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