using a different aftercooler

[bolus]

I think it will be okay since the last session I ran at atomfest, I didn't use any water (it was turned off).  Now if I was aggressively tuned for methanol it would probably be a different story

[DarthChicken]

The stock ECU (and I assume the brammo ecu) add or subtract timing based on AIT.  It was actually causing a little confusing today on the dyno, because my timing was changing for no reason sometimes... it was VERY odd, until we figured out that I was gaining a degree because my AIT were dropping during the pull.  

[silver]

Well good luck to you sir, do you know when your next session of tuning will occur?

[maverick1]

Personally, I would rather add or replace the current aftercooler to a more efficient one than to fool around with water injection. Water injection sounds like a more complicated solution than a different aftercooler and requires constant maintenance.
Plus, living in southern California my Atom will probably be subjected to some very high temperatures in the summer.
I think I will probably get the remote oil cooler/filter to help with this extra heat. A really efficient aftercooler I think is the way to go. Just my 2 cents.
Cheersâ?¢

[bolus]

Brammo dynoed our cars with the radiator (same one up front that cools engine coolant) in place of the stock intercooler radiator.  I am not 100% certain but peaking at the results I am pretty sure they did not see any increase in performance.

Water injection is a minimally invasive performance mod.  1 hole in the intake and 3 holes in the rear firewall was all that was needed to install mine.  if it does not work, your engine pulls timing and you loose power back to where you were before you installed the kit in the first place. 

[silver]

Mav, you're going to eat your words when you realize how much work it's going to be to get a REAL working solution in the way of a new aftercooler.

Just like bolus said Brammo's $1,000 aftercooler upgrade didn't even do the trick, so it's not going to be easy to get a solution, and a lot of items are going to have to be altered like the air intake, and the piping for the coolant lines for the aftercooler and then a fully custom built aftercooller to fit.....it's just too much work especially with nothing positive and only negative things to base that mod off of (as in the aformentioned brammo upgrade aftercooler), why wouldn't you go with the simpler solution of water injection.

[positron]

I think your missing the white elephant in the middle of the room, until you increase the thermodynamic efficiency of exchanging the hot air into the circulating water rad in the compressed airflow what is a bigger outside rad going to do? Air to water is inherently inefficient particularly at the wind velocity at speed. You need to stuff more calories into the hot rad faster..

[DarthChicken]

Here's some data for you guys with water injection... this is off a log from Sunday.

IAT starts at 91 degrees, 1568 RPM.  Dynopack holds RPM there for 3 seconds.. I'm at 153Kpa at that point (ie 7.6psi).  

by 1844rpm, I'm at 86 degrees
2065rpm 84 degrees
2270rpm 82 degrees
2356rpm 81 degrees
2496rpm 79 degrees
2572rpm 77 degrees
2794rpm 75 degrees
3014rpm 73 degrees
3189rpm 73 degrees
3511rpm 70 degrees
3858rpm 68 degrees
4291rpm 66 degrees
6250rpm 64 degrees

And it holds that temp to 7076rpm.

NO intercooler will do that.  According to the IAT Spark advance correction, I'm actually ADDING a degree of timing during the pull, instead of losing 5-7 degrees like you guys.  Thats one of the reasons I came in at 260whp, and not 230whp.

[nickpoore]

Silly question.

Does a water injection system inject water ALL the time, or only at specific RPM ranges?

[Kempo]

Hey Darth that's a great job you are doing there  keep that up. Are those the IAT2 figures? and are those on C or F?

[bolus]

[quote="nicolas"]
Silly question.

Does a water injection system inject water ALL the time, or only at specific RPM ranges?
[/quote]

No, Darth's injects based on boost and mine injects based on injector duty cycle (both adjustable).  It depends on the kit.  I can probably stall the car if I turned it on when it was idling.  
I used no water at all driving to atomfest and 1 quart per session at atomfest

[DarthChicken]

[quote="Kempo"]
Hey Darth that's a great job you are doing there  keep that up. Are those the IAT2 figures? and are those on C or F?
[/quote]

F, IAT2 figures.

[Kempo]

those are real low temps. The lower I see on a pass is about 130-140*F. After 5 laps at the track it gets to 180-190*F

[DarthChicken]

Thats just water... imagine what methanol would do 

[bolus]

FYI, I ordered calscot's intercooler from TTS Performance.  This is the one that is custom made to sit in the hoop.  This is air to air so wont work with the stock ecotec.  But I think it will be great for a turbo application  I was going to hold off but with the dropping dollar I did not want to wait and end up paying triple. 

To order email Richard at richard@tts-performance.co.uk for details £400