Roller Bearing Bell Cranks - RBBC's

[Jammer]

What are these rbbc,s specifically, and do US Atoms have them as I dont see it as an option.

[benyeats]

[quote="Jammer"]
What are these rbbc,s specifically, and do US Atoms have them as I dont see it as an option.
[/quote]

I think they are standard on US Atoms, hence no option

Ben

[Driver]

Standard on the Brammo.  I haven't seen a good pict of one yet though (hint to anyone that has the chance).

[coxm]

Let's be clear, ALL suspension joints must work properly and to do so, they need to be properly lubricated.  From the crate, brand new and perfectly lubricated, virtually all the stiction is caused by the PBBCs, so they are the fundamental issue that needs to be dealt with to make the suspension work.  Over time, the various joints will get stiffer and the level of stiction overall will increase.  I think that Sailcote is as good as any. I use a different product from Nippy Normans, which is very similar.

If you want to check your theory, get it up on blocks, disconnect the springs so that you can move the suspension freely and try moving it.  I did that lots of times and never found any issue with stiction in the rod ends.  They do wear - now, Puff had a pretty hard life so its unlikely that anyone would wear them out a lot quicker than we did, and we changed the rod ends annually.  That's probably excessive, but I'm obsessive about things like that since I don't want to have to think about whether they are perfect or not:  I can't commit a car if I am worrying about the maintenance.  To check the wear, you have to feel for any free play.  Good old fashioned get your hands dirty, try to move them and if you even think there is any movement, change them..

Another overall test, is to park the car on flat ground, lift the nosecone an inch or so and see if it stays there.  Both of mine always did with PBBCs, never did with RBBCs.  If the car's weight can't return the car to its neutral position, there is clearly too much stiction.  I found with the PBBCs that even from new the car wouldn't return properly; as they got older, the worse it got grease or not.

On cleaning, I think Ross is the guru.  Mine were pressure washed - avoiding the suspension completely which I washed with a hosepipe - or simply wiped with a rag soaked in WD40 which was as quick as anything and I like poking and prodding things to check them over.  I also found that the WD40 stops flies and so on sticking.

MC

Jammer, I don't wish to be awkward, but please read the topic / search on RBBCs and you will find plenty of detail.  I know its tedious to read all the pages but believe me, its even more tedious answering the same question 20 times over.

Driver, there are pics of the Brammo RBBCs somewhere on the forum.

[ross]

[quote="coxm"]On cleaning, I think Ross is the guru[/quote]

At some point, I really should do a guide - can't claim to be a guru, I'm probably just a bit anally retentive on this front

[AtomFun]

Would it be possible to put your anal retentive thoughts into the forthcoming manual as an addendum? Or, would this further delay it's production?

[Bruce Fielding]

I am emailing Ross the relevant sections from the manual for his perusal and comments...

[ross]

[quote="AtomFun"]
Would it be possible to put your anal retentive thoughts into the forthcoming manual as an addendum? Or, would this further delay it's production?
[/quote]

Yeah, I can almost guarantee that it would delay it!  But I'll definitely take a look anyhow and add send any thoughts to Bruce.

[AtomFun]

Oh well! Roll on Christmas 2007

[Scottsman]

MC,

Thanks for the info.

Regarding the handbook let's not get carried away with putting everything in it. Somewhere on the forum there is a detailed photographic guide to replacing the radiator. This hasn't made it into the handbook and quite right too - let's keep the free flow of info going.

Alastair.

[ross]

[quote="Scottsman"]
let's keep the free flow of info going.
[/quote]

Yep, very good point.

[dingo]

This is as good a picture as I've seen of a US Bell Crank that shows the RBBC. I hope it is useful.
The bearings within the bore of the Bell Crank are held within a cassette. The cassette is pressed into the bore.
What you (might just) see is a yellow O-ring that forms part of a labyrinth seal over the post on which it sits.
This setup is comprised of fewer individual parts than the UK RBBC configuration. 
I have those and have had them apart.
No further comment.

[jon b]

[quote="dingo"]
This is as good a picture as I've seen of a US Bell Crank that shows the RBBC. I hope it is useful.
The bearings within the bore of the Bell Crank are held within a cassette. The cassette is pressed into the bore.
What you (might just) see is a yellow O-ring that forms part of a labyrinth seal over the post on which it sits.
This setup is comprised of fewer individual parts than the UK RBBC configuration. 
I have those and have had them apart.
No further comment.


[/quote]

From memory -  my UK RBBC's bearings are welded in place.  If these are just as stable then this looks a much more clean and probable cheaper solution 

[dingo]

What you're seeing in the way of a weld on UK RBBC is around the circumference of the tube to which the faces of the bell crank are attached.
It starts off as three pieces. (sans bearings) The tube holds the bearings. 

That welding is done well before the bearings come anywhere near the bell crank assembly.
I think the next step is powdercoating with bore of tube masked off, then bearings pressed in.

I can assure you that the bearing holder for UK RBBC is not welded in place.

[coxm]

The other point to note is that the Brammo bearings do not have the thrust element that the INA/FAG bearings have in the UK one.  I haven't tried both for comparison, but I've got to believe that there is a good reason why Simon chose the thrust / roller combination for the UK ones.

MC