Cat S 3.5 on YouTube

[reg]

If you actually listen to what they say, they refer to their previous comment and say they don't mean the C word but still consider rich, going off the invoice that they're reading out. For most people paying over £200 for locking wheel nuts to be taken off is an extortionate amount, most tyre shops will do it for significantly less. And £800 does sound excessive for transport but it obviously depends on location, but I had an Atom shipped over from Ireland to Manchester a couple of years ago for a third of that.

3 hrs labour wasn't it? Lost key, knackered key, who knows. Obviously the previous owner thought it was ok. There's always an option to DIY. On the transport, again it is a choice.

If you mean inquisitive interest, hell yes, I'm interested in learning anything new I haven't picked up already on these cars......You can have whatever opinion you want but like I said in my first post, it's a repetitive pattern I've seen for the past 10 years with. The "holier than though" crew i referred to earlier start pointing fingers and it stifles anything productive or different from happening outside the narrative of what the factory dictates, and many owners have just walked away.

This case is unique. Never seen one with chassis damage being repaired like this.

Just because you own an Atom it may make you unique, but it doesn't make you special. So by all means have whatever opinion you want but be respectful of the fact others are entitled to their opinion too, and just because their opinion may be different to your or the factories it doesn't make it any less of an opinion.

This is the same factory that you have copied various parts from and sell as a business, their opinion doesn't matter, I would say given your situation it matters quite a bit really. And as you say, everyone is entitled to an opinion.

My grievance isn't how this lot are being treated, but just generally how anyone that does anything different is treated by said members. I've never had an issue with going toe-to-toe with anyone I disagree this, and you can search back through the years and read my various clashes with Tom and other memebers, but the fact is most people just shut up and walk away and it's contributed to the errosion the forum.

Intelligent debate, is what makes a forum.

Then I suggest you're insured for track driving and if you're really that scared of driving on the same tarmac as anything that's accident repaired then I suggest you sell all your cars and get a horse and cart.

Scared, ok hamtt, missing the point.

The frame may well be not fit for the car but like I said before. I know at least ONE person that's been negative that actually has a car that was frame damaged worse than this and had a tube section replaced at the rear replaced. I also know of at least two other Atoms that have had front-end impact and tubes repaired near the front suspension that have been repaired outside of the factory. At least theres 100% transparency on this and no-one's being duped.

So what, if a chassis has been repaired with new tubes, and the guys can weld it's going to be fine. It's a bit of a stretch to include this with hitting things with a slide hammer and using some filler

And looking down at "120 hp MX5 track mutt" owners really doesn't do you any favours. Refere to my earlier post re "pompous twits".

Nobody is, it's you trying to make an issue out of something that is not there. If you read the posts on here nobody is saying anything other than things relating to basic common sense

Like I said. All good fun, until it isn't.

[Hedge]

I think, for what it's worth, it's safe to say the factory know exactly what car this is by now. And they won't touch it with a barge pole if it ever came their way. Not to detract from someone buying it, just making any potential buyer aware, that's all.

Cheers,
Hedge

[mynamesnotbob]

I personally find it (the repair) interesting, at complete odds with how I would repair a car, but interesting nonethelessless

I know I am new here, and probably shouldn't say but I don't get why this is causing so much agro - its a repair done in the public domain with full transparency, and it is done for entertainment purposes. None of this will remove the CatS tag unless its exported, but that's a different issue

These sort of write off builds are not unique - other marques forums will have one or two going through them (I can think of lotus, Mclaren and M car rebirths without trying), and some fail, some almost fail and the builders learn some stuff, some do things better than factory. All info is good info, you don't have to only see perfection to learn from it.

Little random bits like imperial thread comments, I don't need to know that now. But if I swap out a wishbone at some point that little nugget stored away will be helpful before a wang an M16 tap in it without thinking. All if these little bits are useful, try doing a K20 transplant - knowing those sensors are a mix of NPT, BSP, metric, etc has meant I always double and triple check when building up a loom or plumbing it up

If this sort of frame repair scares you, please don't go anywhere near historic motorsport! The level of frame repair seen in the vids would be considered pedantic by some of the historic racers I've been around

Like I say I wouldn't fix a chassis like that, but its interesting seeing it

[8_enj]

Its finally finished.....

[hamtt]

3 hrs labour wasn't it? Lost key, knackered key, who knows. Obviously the previous owner thought it was ok. There's always an option to DIY. On the transport, again it is a choice.

No it wasn't lost keys. It was removing the nuts. If it was lost keys they would have invoiced the fob separately and charged for reprogramming it or probably replaced the whole immobiliser. And if it took them 3 hours to break off locking wheel nuts then clearly they're not very good at it. Take it to a tyre place and either they'll hammer on a similar sized socket or they'll weld on a hex nut and do all 4 in probably half an hour to an hour. I've had it done a few times over the years.

This case is unique. Never seen one with chassis damage being repaired like this.

Then watch and learn. Like I said, it may work, it may not.

This is the same factory that you have copied various parts from and sell as a business, their opinion doesn't matter, I would say given your situation it matters quite a bit really. And as you say, everyone is entitled to an opinion.

Ha ha oh dear, you sound like one of the people who at the outset was threatening me I couldn't make wings for the atom because they were "patented" by Ariel. If the factory believes I have copied something of theirs, there's a simple way to resolve it - courts. And don't think for a second the factory haven't looked at every part I've done and explored their options.

Intelligent debate, is what makes a forum.

Yes intelligent debate, not snootiness and closed rank "bullying" by established members. Intelligent debate involves an intelligent question and an intelligent response. Not the now-worn-out "oh no I wouldn't touch that with a barge pole because it's not done/made/repaired by the factory" and "oh wait - I'm gonna tell Mummy at the factory about this".

Scared, ok hamtt, missing the point.

Whatever the reason, I still say if you don't want to share the road with anything that may be written off repaired, damaged, leaking oil, potentially dangerous, you go buy a horse and cart. It's the drivers on a track that make it dangerous, not the cars. If that was the case then anyone without a whole F1 support team wouldn't be allowed on the track.

So what, if a chassis has been repaired with new tubes, and the guys can weld it's going to be fine. It's a bit of a stretch to include this with hitting things with a slide hammer and using some filler

Can you guaranteed the correct tubing was used? Can you guarantee that the welder was competent and did an adequate job? What's more laughable than the filler is that you seem to find an undocumented larger and potentially more dangerous repair more acceptable than something that's transparent.

Nobody is, it's you trying to make an issue out of something that is not there. If you read the posts on here nobody is saying anything other than things relating to basic common sense

Like I said. All good fun, until it isn't.

There's clearly an issue. The only response they got on here and Facebook from Atom owners was negative, until I posted on here and then some others said positive things. There's clearly issues with this "community" and like I said earlier, it's far displaced from the reality and perception of "normal" people, and if you don't see that, you're part of the problem. Hitler didn't see anything wrong with what he was doing either.

[hamtt]

I personally find it (the repair) interesting, at complete odds with how I would repair a car, but interesting nonethelessless

I know I am new here, and probably shouldn't say but I don't get why this is causing so much agro - its a repair done in the public domain with full transparency, and it is done for entertainment purposes. None of this will remove the CatS tag unless its exported, but that's a different issue

These sort of write off builds are not unique - other marques forums will have one or two going through them (I can think of lotus, Mclaren and M car rebirths without trying), and some fail, some almost fail and the builders learn some stuff, some do things better than factory. All info is good info, you don't have to only see perfection to learn from it.

Little random bits like imperial thread comments, I don't need to know that now. But if I swap out a wishbone at some point that little nugget stored away will be helpful before a wang an M16 tap in it without thinking. All if these little bits are useful, try doing a K20 transplant - knowing those sensors are a mix of NPT, BSP, metric, etc has meant I always double and triple check when building up a loom or plumbing it up

If this sort of frame repair scares you, please don't go anywhere near historic motorsport! The level of frame repair seen in the vids would be considered pedantic by some of the historic racers I've been around

Like I say I wouldn't fix a chassis like that, but its interesting seeing it

My points precisely.

[autobackup]

Hamtt

You make some good points but also some dubious assertions as well - particularly about the frame tubes!

The overall integrity/strength of a tubular frame is dictated by the tubes being perfectly tubular - dents significantly weaken it because the dents will be where the tube 'folds' if exposed to too much stress!

You may remember my accident (fully documented in this forum) which resulted in very similar damage - I had my Atom evaluated and tested by a highly qualified professional metals stress engineer and, based on his report, I decided that the only safe option was to have the frame sent back to Ariel's frame builders for a professional repair using the proper frame jig, it was then repowdercoated (2018 new Gunmetal) and it was also upgraded to the full 3.5R frame spec with provision to fit a SADEV box should I decide to ever go down that (expensive) route in the future.

This was followed by a complete rebuild from scratch with many new/upgraded parts and the car is now, once again, absolutely perfect in all respects and I have full confidence in it!

. I am sorry but nothing you have said persuades me that using a slide hammer and some filler on such a powerful car, given the huge stresses capable of being transmitted through the drive system, is either advisable or safe!

[8_enj]

The final video with costings

[Hedge]

So, final bill: £25k.

Sounds like they're going to hang onto it for a while (6m+), use it on a track & do (more) burnouts. They're also mulling over doing "some things to it".

Cheers,
Hedge

[Jerry]

£25k - can't argue with that.

[autobackup]

Interesting that no mention was made during the video on how many labour hours it took and what that would have cost.

I suspect that it was 'fully' priced up including labour costs it would have been considerably more than £25000!

[reg]

Interesting that no mention was made during the video on how many labour hours it took and what that would have cost.

I suspect that it was 'fully' priced up including labour costs it would have been considerably more than £25000!

Indeed. And quite amusing that now they are thinking of repairing the tubes ‘properly’, that’ll be two hammers

It’s worth what they paid. No more. It’ll always be a mutt, but yes, £25K.

[IanG]

Impossible to sell though
Interestingly why did the insurance company write it off

[autobackup]

That's an easy one

- pre accident value circa +/- £42k'ish

Proper repair INC LABOUR & VAT circa £30k - £35k'ish with new powder coated frame?

Pay owner value less excess

Sell wreck for £20k

Nett cost to the insurance company £20k - 25k as opposed to circa £30k - £35k if they repair it!

[IanG]

That's an easy one

- pre accident value circa +/- £42k'ish

Proper repair INC LABOUR & VAT circa £30k - £35k'ish with new powder coated frame?

Pay owner value less excess

Sell wreck for £20k

Nett cost to the insurance company £20k - 25k as opposed to circa £30k - £35k if they repair it!

On those figures I can see why

My man maths put it at 20 to 30k
12K Parts
5K labour £70 an hour = 70 ish hours
5k frame repair
VAT should not come into it as they would claim that back all the repairs I have done for insurance company’s they never take the VAT into consideration